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Create Digital Music notices Griff

 
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daniel



Joined: 03 Oct 2003
Posts: 279

PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 5:14 pm    Post subject: Create Digital Music notices Griff Reply with quote



The lovely people at Create Digital Music have posted about Griff.

A choice quote:
"And you know, while we’ve seen some apps come close, we really haven’t seen an iPhone app quite this comprehensive."

Thanks Guys, that's probably true today but you've got to think that the days of Griff being the mobile music making king are numbered and my bet for the new champion would be:
.


Just look at the beauty of it. I have no idea what it does, or how it sounds but it just looks so exciting. Good luck noise.io guys, I hope you can make a living out of your fabulous skills.

Watch a video
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Daniel Webb
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imtim



Joined: 25 Mar 2009
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:26 am    Post subject: music apps on iPhone Reply with quote

Hi Daniel

Was great meeting you a couple of years back now, and is great to see mobile music making taking off in so many ways. Not so good for those who started early, like you and us (now Intermorphic.com, but we were SSEYO.com), but is still good to see. Smile Your points are, as ever, good ones! It is amazing to see the quantity and quality of music apps hitting the iPhone.

I thought I would add to this that we now expect to bring out Mixtikl http://www.intermorphic.com/tools/mixtikl/ for iPhone in the next 2-3 months (touch wood). Mixtikl is a 12 track mixer (including generative), and the successor to SSEYO miniMIXA. We first launched it for Windows Mobile in Dec 2008 and have had made a number of updates, with another one coming soon, which is what we will prob end up porting to iPhone (we already have Mixtikl running in iPhone emulation). I must admit that it is exciting seeing how mobile hardware has improved in the last 7 years Smile, but it never moves as fast as one might expect! However, that said, Apple have done an amazing job in breaking open the market for mobile (music) apps. If only Microsoft had been as fleet of foot as Apple....

Anyhow, wishing you all the very best of luck for Griff!

tim
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daniel



Joined: 03 Oct 2003
Posts: 279

PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Tim, thanks for dropping by and posting.

I've been following your *tikl apps for a while now, mainly on palm sounds. I'm impressed by your industry (working over christmas!), and the speed with which you are churning out code. I have to say I find it astounding that you are able to make a living out of mobile music software, and I'm very jealous that you do.

My concern is that in trying to be the jack of all platforms you end up being the master of none, but then again this 'trans-platform-ness' does mean that you shouldn't be dragged down by the failure of any one mobile os.

I'll keep cheering for you guys and there's always a warm welcome to you here at planetgriff HQ if you're ever down this way again.

Good work Fellas
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Daniel Webb
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imtim



Joined: 25 Mar 2009
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

daniel wrote:
I've been following your *tikl apps for a while now, mainly on palm sounds. I'm impressed by your industry (working over christmas!), and the speed with which you are churning out code.


Thanks Daniel! Well, we do work hard at it, but then so do all developers I guess! That said, development progress is never as fast as hoped... Smile

daniel wrote:

I have to say I find it astounding that you are able to make a living out of mobile music software, and I'm very jealous that you do.


Well, it is early days yet, but I think mobile will ultimately be an interesting area to be in! When you look at the power of desktop sequencers and synths these days, it is mind boggling how fast that side of the industry has moved. It seems that its only the companies that have scaled that have really been able to keep it going.

Mobile apps may be changing business models and perceptions, though. The bigger companies may be able to bring out controller apps (as you noted), but is there a market for them with $5 apps that still cost a lot to develop (and those costs will surely only get worse, too)? Time will tell. When you are used to selling $500 software packages it is hard to focus on something priced at less than 1% of that! I remember many years ago how individual productivity software packages were high priced, then the suites came out and decimated the market in the space of 2 years. Anyhow, all change, as ever.

daniel wrote:

My concern is that in trying to be the jack of all platforms you end up being the master of none, but then again this 'trans-platform-ness' does mean that you shouldn't be dragged down by the failure of any one mobile os.


Indeed, its tough, and who knows what is going to happen to Windows Mobile, Symbian, Android, LiMo, Linux, iPhone, Flash, let alone Java on any of the open or closed devices.

When developing for anything other than iPhone, one of the biggest problems these days is the sheer number of device form factors there are to support, and that means application display areas as well as RAM (fast or slow, how much), processor, OS and OS versions, keypad, navkey, touchscreen and any combination of those etc. etc. Even in Windows mobile there are a _huge_ number of device variations with (to be realistic) quite small individual installed bases. Then there are the Operator issues.... sigh.

Small developers then, like us, either have to choose to target one OS and maybe even a handful of devices (but who knows what devices will be successful until they are!), or find a way to abstract as much as possible, port where as we can, have relatively skinnable UIs and then get out as many versions as possible.

iPhone is a kind of is a mono-platform and so is great for mobile app developers. Near enough one form factor, one OS, high performance, common capability etc. Microsoft had the opportunity to be where Apple are now, but Apple have been smarter.

In many ways I wish we had gone the iPhone road first, but for many reasons we went Windows Mobile Smartphone/Pocket PC, and also Windows and Mac desktops. In so doing, though, we have of necessity had to develop an approach that makes Mixtikl (the apps and underlying audio technologies) _reasonably_ Smile easy to port and reskin. Unfortunately, our main efforts have gone into that area, rather than extending feature sets! The features will come, though. Smile.

So, coming back to your point: apps dedicated to squeezing the max out of one platform, or trans-platform apps that get 80%-90% of the way there? It really is a tough, tough call. If we were starting out again, from scratch, I would probably say stick with one platform but (obviosly) try make sure we picked the winner. 2 years ago that was Symbian, but now it looks like Apple - so that is not easy Smile. The reason I would say choose one platform (or a virtual platform if they manage to crack the mobile market) iis that is I know how much graft we have had to put in to go trans-platform Sad. However, now we have done that, then there is no point us doing anything else and we might as well keep going Smile.

daniel wrote:

I'll keep cheering for you guys and there's always a warm welcome to you here at planetgriff HQ if you're ever down this way again.


Thanks Daniel. We will keep cheering for you, too, and the same offer goes from us to you!

With best wishes

tim
http://www.intermorphic.com
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daniel



Joined: 03 Oct 2003
Posts: 279

PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 8:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
iPhone is a kind of is a mono-platform and so is great for mobile app developers. Near enough one form factor, one OS, high performance, common capability etc. Microsoft had the opportunity to be where Apple are now, but Apple have been smarter.


Apple is pretty much exactly where microsoft was in 2000 when we started work on Griff:
    A class leading OS (PocketPC 2000),
    One form Factor (240x320, dPad, 4 buttons),
    Exciting hardware (iPaq, [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jornada_(PDA)#Pocket_PCs]jornada[/url], cassiopeia)
    Lots of buzz
    Lots of developers


It will be interesting to see how Apple manage the growth of the iTouch devices as users start making feature requests:
    We want bigger screens!
    We want different form factors!
    Keys!
    Buttons!

Please, Apple, don't listen to them.
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Daniel Webb
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imtim



Joined: 25 Mar 2009
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 9:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

It will be interesting to see how Apple manage the growth of the iTouch devices as users start making feature requests:
    We want bigger screens!
    We want different form factors!
    Keys!
    Buttons!

Please, Apple, don't listen to them.


Yes, it is going to be interesting. Fragmentation is the big problem, even within a platform. Apple, though, have a one-stop-shop solution in which device capability is just one aspect. They also provide one store, and one route to market with reasonable margin. And, there are no operators involved taking their (huge) cut with their restrictions.

This was why I mentioned the "suite" analogy above - Apple have done a similar kind of thing by bringing everything together under one roof (i.e. including services). Is Microsoft too late with MarketPlace? Who knows. And why do they not allow the OS (except in some cases) to be upgraded OTA? Probably because of operators, and their customisations.

I think Apple can go from strength to strength if they can keep close to the end customer., This is something Nokia tries to do, too, but it does not seem to have had the negotiating strength Apple have had when it comes to operators - perhaps cos it needs them more.

Imho it is when the operators are allowed ot set the agenda (if it happens, as I am guessing was the case with Microsoft) that things might come unstuck! Let's see what happens! Smile
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daniel



Joined: 03 Oct 2003
Posts: 279

PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 12:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Imho it is when the operators are allowed ot set the agenda (if it happens, as I am guessing was the case with Microsoft) that things might come unstuck!


I think this is why Google were pushing for open platforms to be part of the requirements when bidding for wireless spectrum last year. They're as fed up with the operators as you seem to be.

They seem to be winning, at least in the states.
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imtim



Joined: 25 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

daniel wrote:

I think this is why Google were pushing for open platforms to be part of the requirements when bidding for wireless spectrum last year. They're as fed up with the operators as you seem to be.


The problem with Android, for audio app developers at least, is that it is Java only (and a Google flavour at that - "Dalvik"). So, no native apps.... Sad

Maybe as virtualisation technologies get adopted, such as the Antix Player http://www.antixlabs.com, things will improve....
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ASHLEY75



Joined: 04 Oct 2003
Posts: 9
Location: London

PostPosted: Sat Apr 11, 2009 9:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, Daniel, any thoughts about a Griff port to the iPhone as yet? The latest app iSyn looks a lot like a simplified version of Griff. You should take a look.
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